My town made international news! Obama/Hitler Tea Party sign

[Tom Brazelton]

It's not a question of judging the whole town or assuming everyone who lives in Mason City has the same opinion. It's a form of protest that puts economic pressure on the community in an effort to eliminate hateful rhetoric.

Not that it would be a very effective protest, mind you. As Linc points out, most people would probably never travel to Mason City anyway. So it's a hollow threat.

[IsaacMahomie]

Yeah, exactly. What does it matter if someone in Colorado or North Dakota swears to never set foot in Mason City? There's a 99% chance they won't be. Besides Meredith Wilson and "The Music Man" we don't have much going on here. There's a chance that even if someone unknowingly passes through here, they wouldn't even be aware of it. The whole thing is sad, silly, and fascinating. I'm sure some sociology student will write a paper on this whole debacle.
Also, the sign was put up by an individual, the Tea Party itself asked him to take it down. Its not like it was funded by the community or anything.

[logosmonkey]

Well, mostly, people like to feel like they're doing something important without ever actually... you know... doing something. It's why I think prayer is so popular despite a number of studies showing it's utter lack of effect.

It's also rather misplaced, as most protests of this sort are. This is a privately owned billboard, in reality outside of what's considered publicly indecent the owners can put whatever they want up. There's really no point in protesting the town when it's the decision of the sign owners. You're only hurting people that may actually already be on your side and likely having little to no effect on those who are against you. I'm sure some people come at a protest like this with sincerity but for the most part it feels a lot like people jumping on a bandwagon because the bandwagon isn't really going that far and there's no mud on the trail.
As far as the sign goes, it's stupid and illogical. But, that's the Tea Party M.O. anyway. Protest higher taxes even though you're paying one of the lowest tax rates the country has seen in the past 30 some odd years and one of the lowest in the world. Yeah, that'll teach em.

[IsaacMahomie]

people like to feel like they're doing something important without ever actually... you know... doing something. It's why I think prayer is so popular despite a number of studies showing it's utter lack of effect.

Woah, that is a loaded statement. But, then again I am currently preparing a sermon where a lot of the focus is on who we're praying to... which is pretty important.

I haven't made up my mind about the Tea Party yet.

[logosmonkey]

people like to feel like they're doing something important without ever actually... you know... doing something. It's why I think prayer is so popular despite a number of studies showing it's utter lack of effect.

Woah, that is a loaded statement.

Yeah, I know. I know a lot of people disagree with me on that fact as well, but still, it's my belief based on all the evidence I have. (and science has for that matter.)

Also, I don't really care if you believe in prayer or not. It's not really my point. I think too many people are willing to shirk responsibility for their lives and politics by taking part in that sort of protest and content themselves in inaction. I just personally believe prayer works the same way.

[LincM]

Yeah, I know. I know a lot of people disagree with me on that fact as well, but still, it's my belief based on all the evidence I have. (and science has for that matter.)

Hmmmm, again, another loaded statement without little to back it up other than "science has". I can argue with as weak a statement as that.

To the contrary, there are changes in the physical body contrary to any scientific explanation other than defining the condition or change as an "act of God". I'm talking about healing on a physical and metaphysical (i.e. brain physiology) level. Hundreds of studies have been unexplained with a final resolution being that it was due to an external, inexplicable force. Literally hundreds.

[IsaacMahomie]

"demonic possession" is also considered a phenomenon and has scientists stumped.

A lot of people have misconceptions about prayer, so trying to study it scientifically is rather, well, difficult.

[logosmonkey]

Benson, Dusek and Hibbard did what most consider the most thorough study in the area. It was in Volume 151 Issue 4 of the American Heart Journal, you can see the abstract here http://www.ahjonline.com/article/S0002-8703(05)00649-6/abstract but there is a paywall for the article. I can't find a copy of it for free online but you can probably get a print version at a well stocked library.

There are a ton of others studies as well but they are, for the most part, scientifically flawed. Usually from improper sample sizes and methodology or just media hype mis-interpreting the actual studies (or authors like Larry Dossey dramatically misrepresenting certain studies). They range the gamut of for and against, but few to none are really repeatable.

Also, to clarify, the lack of impact or negative impact has really only been shown in prayer for others. Ones own prayer does show some evidence of a positive effect, generally it seems to be the same effects one can receive from different forms of meditation.

[logosmonkey]

What's the misconception?

[logosmonkey]

Also, as far as demonic posession goes, that's kind of a cop out. For the most part the symptoms from historically documented cases resemble frontal lobe epilepsy or other such diseases. As far as modern day cases go, I'm not sure there has been any direct study of it. Just from a logistical standpoint I think it would be extremely difficult and doubly so to have any seriously rigorous study. Can you point me to an example of a modern day case that has 'science' stumped? To be honest, I've never put in much time researching it outside of one class in school, but that didn't focus on any modern day cases.

[logosmonkey]

Hundreds of studies have been unexplained with a final resolution being that it was due to an external, inexplicable force. Literally hundreds.

Also, could you cite some? I have to question the rigor and validity of a study that would conclude that without exception. Generally, a study that followed the scientific method and standard methodologies would conclude that their study was inconclusive, rarely would they attribute it to an 'external, inexplicable force'.

[IsaacMahomie]

I don't have anything I can cite. I was reading about it somewhere, don't remember where. But from personal experiences, I can say definitely that prayer isn't worthless.

[logosmonkey]

And that's fine, it's your prerogative. It doesn't change the belief I have (and it's not just because it's your anecdotal evidence, it's rare that I would out and out trust anyone's) and back to the topic of the thread, I think that sort of protest is hollow and generally useless.

[BluTGI]

Most protests or boycots are hollow. The first step when arguing an issue is NEVER protest. Protest is the second to last act when fighting for any issue.

1. Research
2. Fact Check
3. Research Legal process
4. Protest via Legal Process
5. Soap Box, speak in public, garner media attention, garner support for your side of the issue.
6 protest via legal process

If you are dealing with a rational issue, with rational people, and your argument is logically sound, then you will most likely never have to go beyond this issue.

7. Boycott.
8. Protest via various methods, example picket lines.
9. Violence.
10. War.

Each step should repeat all of the previous steps.

However most of these tea partys are simply citizens joining on to a cause they don't understand, they are joining in at step 8 with out EVER doing steps 1-7.

If you really wanted to appeal a tax issue... The first step is not to stop paying your taxes.

While not everyone can spend so much time doing all of the work involved... they should at least do steps 1-2 before attending or agreeing to support anything.

[Tom Brazelton]

However most of these tea partys are simply citizens joining on to a cause they don't understand, they are joining in at step 8 with out EVER doing steps 1-7.

In my opinion, the Tea Party is a thinly constructed platform of"political activism" for people who can't believe a black man is President.

People who are so thoroughly convinced that we are being led into socialism through health care and financial reform, but confusingly didn't seem to mind the Patriot Act stripping away personal freedoms or tax cuts for the richest 1% while Bush was in charge.